Post by Chris on Nov 24, 2005 4:54:41 GMT
First, thanks for writing this great piece of software. I ran through the excellent tutorial tonight and could easily see how Scrivener could be adapted to the way I tackle writing projects.
I'd sent you some ideas on a tagging subsystem in the mode of del.icio.us with my beta access request. Having now taken a closer look at Scrivener, I think I see better how it would fit and how I might limp along without a formal system using the features already present.
The basic idea (which I see is now represented on the ToDo list) is to allow each document (if not each notecard, annotation or synopsis) to have zero-to-many "tags" associated with it. These metadata tags could either be searched for directly using the search box (with boolean logic supported), or navigated through in the search results pane.
Tags could serve as a sort of running concept index (like the index of a book). In fact, I think you have the beginning of the idea present in the current version with customizable labels, but there are a couple of limitations to labels. First, it appears that labels have a 1:1 mapping to document fragments. Second, you have to go into a different part of the application conversation to create a new label (e.g., the preferences).
So, suggestions:
1) The "table" could have a column for "tags" which would provide a comma-separated list of metadata tags associated with the item in question. Items in this list could be the equivalents of hyperlinks--click on a tag and have the table view automatically execute a search to match the tag. (This might be better in some kind of free form browser mode, but the table view is the closest now.) Having multiple navigable items in a table cell probably violates Mac guidelines, but it would make it very easy to do keyboard-free navigation of tags/concepts in a project. Just click, and see the items that match the concept you're interested in.
2) Tags could be displayed as a read-only comma-separated list in the notes section of the binder view. E.g., [suggestion, scrivener, beta, item2]. These too could be navigable hyperlinks that show matching items in the table.
3) Storyboard view could have another tab called "tags" (or "concepts"...although concepts is already used as terminology). Or the tags might just appear as a running label below all the tab views.
4) Big question: how to enter tags for a piece of text. Rather than taking the formal approach used for Labels and Concepts, tags should be able to be entered in-line, in the same way that del.icio.us, flickr and other folksonomic-based systems do. For instance, some indicator next to the list of current tags that allows you to do a comma-separated list of tags. Or a quick dialog like the one for annotations that allows you to quickly add ad hoc tags. Even cooler: like del.icio.us, offer suggestions for tags based on previous tags so that an item can be tagged by simply clicking on a suggestion and having it added. How to do suggestions: look at popular tags used in this project, analyze the text for keywords (e.g., like Amazon's "distinctive phrases"), etc. (Suggestions wouldn't be that important--it's probably too much work for too little gain.)
5) Other ways to navigate tags? Besides the ideas above, here are some ideas that might be "nice to haves" but certainly not necessary. (Feature-bloat hackles should be rising when I talk about this stuff.) A new view that shows you a map of concepts in the project. One could be a kind of weighted concept display, where the size or weight of the font corresponds to how frequently the tagged concept appears in the metadata (numerous tagging sites have some variation of this...del.icio.us and technorati and Yahoo! come to mind). Another might be a linked graph view that shows tags that are associated with each other.
(These views aren't all that functional, just interesting, non-linear ways to get the feel for a project as notes are assembled. What are the important or recurring concepts?)
+++
The power of such a tagging system is that it takes the Label idea and expands it, adding great flexibility in how you can organize and navigate a project. As a bonus, someone could almost even use it to actually index a manuscript (just add a fragment at the end that alphabetizes tags and associates it with a page number, although that's a bit of a stretch.)
I could probably approximate some of this in the current software by using synopsis or notes in conjunction with some textual covention (e.g., using brackets around pieces of text such as [[tag1]], [[tag2]] and then searching using the same convention), but I think there are opportunities here for better navigation and faster input if they get first class treatment.
Just some ideas...I look forward to using Scrivener with or without these features! Play around with del.icio.us for awhile and you'll get the gestalt of tagging.
I'd sent you some ideas on a tagging subsystem in the mode of del.icio.us with my beta access request. Having now taken a closer look at Scrivener, I think I see better how it would fit and how I might limp along without a formal system using the features already present.
The basic idea (which I see is now represented on the ToDo list) is to allow each document (if not each notecard, annotation or synopsis) to have zero-to-many "tags" associated with it. These metadata tags could either be searched for directly using the search box (with boolean logic supported), or navigated through in the search results pane.
Tags could serve as a sort of running concept index (like the index of a book). In fact, I think you have the beginning of the idea present in the current version with customizable labels, but there are a couple of limitations to labels. First, it appears that labels have a 1:1 mapping to document fragments. Second, you have to go into a different part of the application conversation to create a new label (e.g., the preferences).
So, suggestions:
1) The "table" could have a column for "tags" which would provide a comma-separated list of metadata tags associated with the item in question. Items in this list could be the equivalents of hyperlinks--click on a tag and have the table view automatically execute a search to match the tag. (This might be better in some kind of free form browser mode, but the table view is the closest now.) Having multiple navigable items in a table cell probably violates Mac guidelines, but it would make it very easy to do keyboard-free navigation of tags/concepts in a project. Just click, and see the items that match the concept you're interested in.
2) Tags could be displayed as a read-only comma-separated list in the notes section of the binder view. E.g., [suggestion, scrivener, beta, item2]. These too could be navigable hyperlinks that show matching items in the table.
3) Storyboard view could have another tab called "tags" (or "concepts"...although concepts is already used as terminology). Or the tags might just appear as a running label below all the tab views.
4) Big question: how to enter tags for a piece of text. Rather than taking the formal approach used for Labels and Concepts, tags should be able to be entered in-line, in the same way that del.icio.us, flickr and other folksonomic-based systems do. For instance, some indicator next to the list of current tags that allows you to do a comma-separated list of tags. Or a quick dialog like the one for annotations that allows you to quickly add ad hoc tags. Even cooler: like del.icio.us, offer suggestions for tags based on previous tags so that an item can be tagged by simply clicking on a suggestion and having it added. How to do suggestions: look at popular tags used in this project, analyze the text for keywords (e.g., like Amazon's "distinctive phrases"), etc. (Suggestions wouldn't be that important--it's probably too much work for too little gain.)
5) Other ways to navigate tags? Besides the ideas above, here are some ideas that might be "nice to haves" but certainly not necessary. (Feature-bloat hackles should be rising when I talk about this stuff.) A new view that shows you a map of concepts in the project. One could be a kind of weighted concept display, where the size or weight of the font corresponds to how frequently the tagged concept appears in the metadata (numerous tagging sites have some variation of this...del.icio.us and technorati and Yahoo! come to mind). Another might be a linked graph view that shows tags that are associated with each other.
(These views aren't all that functional, just interesting, non-linear ways to get the feel for a project as notes are assembled. What are the important or recurring concepts?)
+++
The power of such a tagging system is that it takes the Label idea and expands it, adding great flexibility in how you can organize and navigate a project. As a bonus, someone could almost even use it to actually index a manuscript (just add a fragment at the end that alphabetizes tags and associates it with a page number, although that's a bit of a stretch.)
I could probably approximate some of this in the current software by using synopsis or notes in conjunction with some textual covention (e.g., using brackets around pieces of text such as [[tag1]], [[tag2]] and then searching using the same convention), but I think there are opportunities here for better navigation and faster input if they get first class treatment.
Just some ideas...I look forward to using Scrivener with or without these features! Play around with del.icio.us for awhile and you'll get the gestalt of tagging.